Hi All

2023 ARMS AGM TOPICS

A recap of James' email:

Purpose is to gather topics for the 2023 discussion for the AGM

• Some topics we need to cover are
• helmets and expiry dates
• schedule
• low car count

_________________
Racing Rookie Coordinator
Advocate of growing motorsports in the Maritimes
2014 Scion FRS, 1988 Honda K-swapped CRX, 2018 Radical SR3 RSX 1340
2020 JCM 1st place

In multiple discussion with racers this year, one point has been made repeatedly - scheduled race days need to proceed without threat of cancellation due to low registration numbers. The only reason to cancel a published race day should be that it is not safe to drive on the track. Encourage early registration - yes. Charge extra for late registration - yes. But we all know how much effort it takes to prepare a race car. It also takes effort to solicit team sponsors, and those agreements are contingent on the car being raced. Threatening to cancel a race 4 days before because of an administrative process not being completed is frustrating at a minimum. Let’s stop doing that. Whatever races dates are scheduled at the AGM need to happen regardless of car counts the week before. And if in November 2024, numbers prove to have been too low, then we can have the discussion again.

_________________
Brent O'Connor
ASCC Member
MHPDC Volunteer
2007 Mustang GT
Kentville

My discussion points:

1. lets get MotorsportReg up and running. Any competitor that has used it, loves it
2. need a race director
3. TRAC Series promotions needs help to grow. Its just me and Joel right now. Anyone who wants to get involved, please let us know.
4. proper quali at JCM please
5. add to rules - decal sizing and placement, and penalty if this is not followed
6. race day format - hopefully its glaringly obvious the A/B format is not working....time between races is not enough, and B race is attended very poorly. Seems people not that interested in 1 hour....we need to figure out how to split a weekend up with lapping and time attack. Needs to be some of the race stuff on Saturday. 1st event school day has sooo much down time, then we cram 8 sessions in one day, if you run the who schedule. I think we should try to arrange it that more people want to run the entire schedule. Lets have some brainstorming on this, think outside the box.
7. there is talk of a car/bike fun weekend be organized for 2024. Anyone interested? Not a competitive event. Think of the Mosport Drive festival. Will be for everyone/camping/families
8. Do we need to run the JCM same weekend as the bikes? Just a thought - but if we race on a Saturday, we can have a big old end of year party sat night....
9. I'm reaching out to the Legends Tour, see if they are interested in running at AMP in 2024
10. Sensory possibly interested interested in organizing/helping with JCM.....bigger and better!
11. what do people want to see from TRAC Series promotions? Ideas please!

Yup, agree with Brent 100% here. Publicly announcing uncertainty about actually having a race I don't think encouraged people to come out.

MotorsportReg, sure. That's a no brainer for me. But it's not fixing a very severe problem.

Race Director position is very important in my mind. I appreciate all who have toiled, but hope we can talk someone with recent experience as a competitor to do it. Tall order I know.

Growing the series/decals/etc.: Appreciate the efforts of Leigh and Joel, but didn't do all that much for me as a competitor. No prizes, no real reason to run all the races, etc. Sorry to be harsh, but them's the facts. I think doing something for the competitors might grow the series more.

Penalizing someone for misplaced decals that only benefit someone else would not sit well with me.

Don't ask me anything about the JCM qualifying. I'm an amateur club racer, I only show up at these things to have fun. Make it too serious and it turns me off. I will happily stay home and get out of everyone's way if winning the first lap or two is the most important feature of the event.

I like the 1-hour. But running it with 5 cars seems sort of stupid. So I don't know what to suggest there.

All this seems negative, but it's not meant to be. I appreciate all the 'old hands' who are involved in the game, but I think we need to work on some new thinking designed to improve the 'racer experience' to both get new people interested and keep them involved. What tempts people to throw fiscal responsibility to the wind and go racing? I don't know, but I think we should be trying to find out (and then doing something with the info).

Sponsors that have paid money to the series benefit all competitors. Note that I said paid - these aren’t donations, they are marketing expenses paid by those businesses to the series. They have every right to expect that their decals will be displayed as was agreed when they sponsored our series. It’s common in all Motorsport - wrong decals, then no points.

Race day format - there does need to be something that allows more time between races, more opportunity for post event fellowship, and more opportunities for each of the track participant groups to intermingle. Ideas - run the races on Saturday. Run the 1 hour on Sunday. Lapping between races Saturday, Time Attack Sunday. Just an idea.

TRAC Series promotions - sign me up to help. Simple things like a draw for entrants at the drivers meeting where they win a prize from a sponsor, as an example, would help the series show it values the competitors.

_________________
Brent O'Connor
ASCC Member
MHPDC Volunteer
2007 Mustang GT
Kentville

I've told some folks I'll put my name in for race director. I can't be at the AGM in November as I'll be away, but if I get voted in, that's cool.

Anyways regarding the schedule, I came up with this as an idea a few years ago and posted it in the 2020 Race Workshop thread - that's why the race names are different, but still the same concept. It can be modified for the school, of course, then run the same for the rest of the season. 2 days gives us a lot more flexibility and it makes it more of an "event" where people can actually stick around Saturday and hang out.

Well, OK if you say so. But I don't think the aim of setting up this sponsorship scheme was to necessarily to benefit the competitors in our race series, and I don't think that's how the money has/is being used. I thought the aim was to contribute more generally to track/infrastructure improvements at AMP, which is fine. But its not helping us grow our race series, which was my point. I think throwing up some small part of the money for an identified prize in the sponsors name at the end of the year for each series would motivate more people to run all the races and generate enthusiasm. Which has been said before, and probably will be again. Lol.

As somebody who gives a small sponsorship to the series I am happy with the intention of it being added into the overall track improvement fund. What I'm not overly happy with is some of that fund being used to offset operating losses or be used as prize money for other racers. It's pay to play in amateur racing. While it's nice seeing the decals on the cars, it does diminish the value quite a bit when they are mostly auto related businesses lol. Some diversification would help to solidify their perceived advertising value.

Dangling cash out there may attract some new faces, but once the cash dries up they will disappear. It's a tough spot, younger generations def don't share the same car bug as some of us older generations, the times are changing. Focusing on growing the ladder system through autoslalom and lapping/track days is where you'll find your new racers imo.

_________________
1999 BMW M Coupe #28 GT4 ARMS Road Racing
1995 BMW 318is #28 XS-A ARMS Autoslalom

http://www.isiautomotive.com

Just a few points, Sorry if these are long winded. Not sure if that's what we want on this forum or not..

I used Motorsport Reg in the states, and its nice, but whatever is easier and cheaper for folks.

Nat's suggestion on 2 day weekends works for me. Would give more time and therefor more interest in running both series as a single driver. Duel drivers have no choice on a Sunday, but these 2 day weekends give people time to look over cars, and repair if needed in between sprints. However, from an already tight operating cost overhead, this may not even be possible.

i agree with Brent on the fact that whatever races are scheduled, are a go, outside of weather/safety. But admin and numbers should not reflect that decision until end of year finances are looked at. Sponsors are paying for a certain amount of exposure during the year, if our races are canceled because of low numbers, that can be a loss of 20% the yearly exposure.. that's a lot.. It also takes away the uncertainty in whether a race will happen or not.. I myself start loading up on the Monday or weekend before as thats usually when I have time. but I guess, If we are running that tight of margines, and its obvious we are going to loose our ass, then.. Gotta do, what ya gotta do. Register early folks! So we know. Dont pull your car out of the trailer the Thursday before and realize its still broke...

The JCM. Lets just qualify. Yes its for fun, but every race throughout the year is for fun.. If anything, the JCM is more professional in the sense there are gift awards at the end. The JCM is a big race, and involves a ton of prep, and more $$ than a sprint race weekend. I'm not throwing my car around AMP with junk tires or brakes for 3 hrs. It usually sees stickers, and a more intense look over knowing its not going under the knife after 25mins, but 3 hrs.. A minor failure can mean major damage.. So yeah. JCM is a serious race. Its the only Enduro my car has seen in 2 years as it just seems to carry some weight. It also brought out tons of new/old drivers this year. Lets keep that going. People want that podium in the JCM. I know I do, but.. I'm slow..ish This race would be a prime candidate for the grid/driver introductions "talked in detail below".. Def a missed opportunity there.

How do we grow the sport?: Raise minimum wage? Elect Donald Trump as PM and bring those jobs back!!... No, that's not gonna work, but we can start by letting the Atlantic Provinces know there is a road racing course here.. "Oh the track up by the airport"... No.. So, I will be trying to get my car out to local car shows and such, and do my best at bringing awareness to the track, and our series. A good start would be more social media pushes, maybe a paid post/facebook ad a few times a year with all of our dates, and such. Make a one-sheet ad type of thing that's easy to share. We could take that same one-sheet and make some prints, and hang them in all the local Napas, shops, ect., maybe have our sponsors put them up in their lobbies. I know we would hang something here at Mackay Real Estate. Having a one-sheet with all the dates, and a nice design, and website/facebook link to give away to folks interested would be a great way to bring awareness.

A. With that push to bring awareness and advertisement, we need to have the Time Attack/lapping crowd part of it. The Grid Life idea has been working down south, so having those 2 day weekends seems like the best way to do it. Push the ads: "Atlantic Motorsports Park Road Racing and Time attack!" "Do you have what it takes?" or something like that Military recruitment slogan... I don't know. But push for lappers, and time attackers to come out.. they are the next racers.. We need to make them feel welcome, and show them the fun we have going wheel to wheel! Only way to convice someone to spend that kind of money on a racecar is to show them how much fun it is. Thats the answer to low numbers. And, maybe a band or BBQ on the Sat in between. Its all about the community, and I myself absolutely love this community.

B. Thanks to Mitch we got some points tallies in between the sprint race weekends. THAT IS SO IMPORTANT! Its racing.. we are being competitive for points, for championship wins. Knowing where we sit in between races is absolutely important, and being able to share the tightness of competition with the fans is also very important. I mean... Its all for fun, and like the late night show "Who's line is it anyways" "Its the race where everything is made up, and the points don't matter". Thanks for that Mitch.

Proposal: From a spectator point of view, and going to events at valley raceway, and Scotia this year, I think we can try something I believe was presented a few years ago, but never made the cut. Whether we do a 2 day weekend, or just the Sunday, we should have a park ferme/ grid walk, and driver introductions over the PA. Makes the event, more of an event, and gives some credit to the drivers, and teams. It also allows for good photo opportunities, and therefor more social media content/ content in general. The idea: Have all cars park in grid before a 1 hr, or first race, maybe even Quali if its not too early. "I'm sure someone may have a better idea of when and where" Over the PA, go down the list of cars introducing drivers, sponsors and such. I know none of us are probably getting an IMSA seat out of this.. but, it shows the appreciation for the drivers and teams. We all know that showing up in anything at this track to race involves big $$$, Big time, and sacrifices. Be cool to try this idea, and see if it works. If the PA is not working.. Well, Ill bring one.
Thanks all I got for now.

Some points on TRAC Series promotions:

I’ll admit, we didn’t do a stellar job this year with Trac series promotion. I was pretty busy this summer. I think Joel was too. We are starting on 2024 planning now, so hopefully we can do a better job. Thanks for the suggestions and ideas above.

Sensory did give out gift certificates in 2021 I think. On top of sponsoring the series. This was an end of year points award I think. No one seemed that thrilled with it, so I stopped. But maybe it’s more the fact on how it’s sold/presented to the racers….

The jcm gift bags were very nice. One issues with this sort of thing with our normal events is we have so many classes to reward - that’s a lot of gift bags!! Can do some random draws, hard luck, hard charger, move of the event type awards/gifts. Or should we bias that sort of thing for end of the year points awards? And we need to do a better job with points - have them posted soon as possible after an event on trac series web site and social…officially.

Trac series promotions did donate approx $5k to amp via jcm this year. 2023. I’m pretty proud of that. We were able to do that because the racers had decals on there cars, plus signage sold at the trac. Should be pretty clear how giving back to amp directly benefits the racers. Other areas the $$’s are spent: fridge for the marshals, helped pay for repairs on the marshal truck, and this year our Volunteer sponsor Donated anti fatigue mats for all the marshal stands. All of this needs to be better communicated to the racers, so they can see what we are doing and accomplishing.

We will have the treasurer present financial details of trac series promotions for 2023 at the agm.

Very few racers mention any of the trac series sponsors in there social. We will do a better job to remind you in 2024.

No one else seems interested enough to comment, so I'll toss another thought out.

Those e-mails raising the possibility of actually cancelling race days for lack of participants has me thinking we are really teetering on the edge of losing the whole thing due to lack of participation. As a desperation measure, would allowing the dyed-in-the-wool regular series participants to buy a season long block registration package before the season begins help to ensure that the scheduled races actually happen help? Probably cost less than a set of tires, for those who wanted to do it... offer a little discount and throw in a guaranteed paddock parking spot and maybe it would fly for a few of us. Refunds offered (of course) for any event subsequently cancelled.

I'm only saying this because I really am worried about the viability of the regular race series. No one (IMO) really seems to care much about our local championships, and that leads to spotty attendance at our events. I don't know how to fix that other than trying to talk things up and trying to generate some excitement. And maybe setting up some sort of financial guarantee plan like I am suggesting. My earlier comments urging the sponsorship guys to consider putting some money into boosting the regular series profile and attracting more participants were stemming from these same concerns.

Just thinking out loud.

Mitch, A few years ago Chris McCrea brought that idea forward and it just didn't seem to gain any support. Could have been that crop of racers or just the overall feel. Its not a bad idea. We have a race committee call prior to the AGM. Ill bring it up and see if we can work some details out prior to the AGM.

We did use the sponsorship account to cover the loss of the racedays. My understanding is ARMS has a allowable loss but we where starting to push the limit of that loss, so TRAC covered the loss. When we started the sponsorship account we made it clear we wanted to support race and have a large enough chunk of money to cover any of races losses. So helping cover the loss so pricing doesn't increase seemed logical and smart. If we didnt, Everything we lost this year would go on next years entrance fees and cost racers more.

I am good for 2 day race weekends, but we did try this a few years ago. racers and volunteers complained and wanted to go back to single day events. So we did. This was talked about at the AGM and I believe voted on as well. Some racers complained about being there at 8AM Saturday morning, while others complained about taking a entire weekend away. No reason why we cant work the schedule to help the morning rush to the track.

The sponsorship stuff. We have some new people joining it for 2024 and are hoping to get the social side going better. Swag sales as well need help and Joanne was nice enough to offer to sell some of it at the gate. I feel we are getting better every year, but running into new issues every year. This year we offered a free T-shirt to every racer. For those who didnt get one, Ill have them at the AGM. I would love to do more. Before we can commit what we will do, We need to see what we have for sponsorship coming in.
My suggestion will be to give a discount to every racer running the series sponsors. Its 1000000000% easier to give a discount then pay out. We will just make it Equal over everyone.

Step #1 will be to get a new Race director. I 100% support Nate on this. We have had a few talks over the last few years and i feel he will be a wicked race director.

_________________
Watch out for porcupine exiting turn 9!!!!!!

AX-1995 Honda Civic CX FSP
RR-1995 Honda DelSol VTEC GT4
2009 Canadian Solosprint Champion.
ARMS Race Director. Race@armsinc.ca

If I get involved, my plan is to not cancel any events barring some type of natural disaster. If we schedule rounds, we're running all those rounds. Also the idea with motorsport reg is that the registration links go up in say... February for all the events. If people want to register for all of them at the same time then, cool. If they want to register the Wednesday before, also cool. I think that things are much less dire as they may seem, but the impression that's given off by those sort of emails isn't great.

Also, I feel a plus, people will see who's registered and it may entice more to come out too.

Unrelated to the current topics, but I think the race school format could use work. My proposal is this:

8-12: No changes. Track walk with instructors, helmet off sessions in street cars then helmets on in street cars.
12-1: Lunch
1:00 - Racecars (students only if needed)
1:25 - Lapping
1:50 - Racecars
2:15 - Lapping
2:40 - Racecars
3:05 - Lapping
3:30 - Racecars
3:55 - Lapping / Prep School Race Grid
4:20 - School Races

I think there are 2 main issues:
-There is a lot of time with no cars, or 1 car on track.
-Existing racers never have any idea if there will be practice for sure that day, or when it starts. Sometimes it's early afternoon, other times it's 30min before the school races. Put it right in the schedule.
-We really need a defined practice for the first weekend that is not the morning of. It was a big deal this year to have practice again on Saturday for those of us that needed it. Big thanks to Alex and Brian for that.
-From the bombardment of emails/questions ASCC alone gets about lapping in May, you could probably get 10-15 lappers out there at the typical race day lapping cost. It really costs nothing to try but anyone that is interested helps out the bottom line.

_________________
'99 BMW M3 / "Elvic"

As for the other topics:

Double weekends: We definitely voted this down like...1 or 2 years ago. I still like the idea of aping gridlife, but it seems like it was definitely not wanted as a whole season thing. My opinion is to pair up with Time Attack when they have their weekend. It even offers a benefit for them where the TA competitors get 2 days of weather to put down laps, which helps in the case of rain or high humidity one day.

I'd love to see a repeat of cars and coffee (but maybe on a smaller scale) at the track. That was an incredible amount of spectators for a car event at AMP.

JCM qualifying: I won't come back to a JCM with a mixed grid. I nearly became bread in an M coupe sandwich and my chassis is a lot less sturdy than a BMW.

TRAC promotions: Feels like the TRAC FB/instagram doesn't do much. You look back at this year and June-August was basically just the FB events being posted. This is another case where we should be stealing gridlife or other series ideas. Profile the drivers once in awhile (especially new ones!), post results in a timely manner, post video highlights, share photo albums, etc. Part of it may be racers not posting stuff enough but it's also not clear at all how we get TRAC to repost what we throw up.

_________________
'99 BMW M3 / "Elvic"

Just a random thought, offered in the spirit of that 'fresh thinking' I said we needed earlier on....

The current 1-hour format seems to be up for discussion at the AGM. I like the races, but think the all the individual class winners/trophies are a bit much. The 1-hour could easily be turned into a straight-up handicap race simply adjusting the mandatory pit stop times for each class (see attachment below). We'd have to invent a break-out for any GT1 cars or faster that show up, but I don't see that as anything that would be too difficult to overcome.

There's advantages and disadvantages to doing something like this. Pros: it brings everyone into a single competition based only on actual finishing order and possibly makes the series-long competition for the big trophy more interesting. Cons: the faster cars would be catching the slower cars and racing for position at the end of each race.

Only offered as a thought... please don't crucify me for trying to find ways to make things more interesting.

I’m not a racer, so don’t have any skin in the game. Please take my comments as an observer perspective. It’s a bit of a chick/egg thing. Racers/Sponsors/Participants/Spectators...which is most important? Can’t have one without the other, so it’s always a balance.

As an F1 fan, the “Netflix” effect cannot be ignored. My observations have been that the public love personal interest, and , unfortunately, drama. Nascar has been doing it for years successfully, and Netflix took F1s game to a whole other level. While I’m not suggesting TRAC have a Netflix series, what I am suggesting is tapping into the teams and personalities and putting them out there for public consumption. I think it was Mike that suggested bits on the teams, racers and cars. Social media may be a cost effective way of doing this for marketing purposes, and then backing that up with “at track” features.

I’ve thought about trying to do something with team interviews and such, but held back by my lack of skills to do this, and the reality that most attendees are either racers or team members, that already know each other. Public attendees, I personally feel, would love this approach, but first there needs to be spectators...and I won’t even talk about PA system

Spectators provide a potential source of competitors through things like the path of autocross, lapping, TA.... Some might even jump right in! Spectators also talk. This comes back to a few comments I’ve read in this thread about not knowing AMP even exists. I’ve personally heard this SO many times. Well hidden and kept secret.

Second, when it comes to getting participants, is MAKE IT EASY. The updated TRAC website is a monumental step forward, with some direction on how to get involved. This approach could be pushed even farther. Part of the issue is the whole structure of ARMS, but it is immensely confusing to get started in 4 wheel motorsports here in NS (aside from the TRAC Website, but first you have to find it). I remember having this conversation with Devon some years ago (prior to the new TRAC site), as I was struggling to figure out how to get to participate at the track and autocross. It was like a secret society, and if you didn’t know the handshake... Make it known, make it simple, make it welcoming (which many are already very good at).

It is truly a fantastic community of people. I cannot say enough good things about the people, the efforts and the entertainment value. It’s a hidden gem that only need the limelight.

Great points JOE! Your perspective is much different than mine, so its very nice to here your thoughts on all this.
Promotions will work with you on those ideas, and work to getting you a better PA! Local short track is doing a lot of this to good effect.



JOEL had an idea he mentioned to me, that I don't think has been posted. Its a simple idea, and very little work to implement, done at the time of registration:

Any GT1,2,3 that only enters one series, goes in the B (WCN) race.
Any GT4,5,6 that only enters one series, goes in the A (Sensory) race.

This solves a few issues in my opinion:
1. will help to balance the A/B field a little
2. very frustrating for a GT1 competitor like myself - if I go out and win races, potentially very little chance to win the points title, due to the fact there was not 3 cars in gt1 so winner can score max points. If we want to make the points matter at the end of the season, every competitor needs a fair shot at them. This will help.
3. very poor optics to spectators if there is 2 GT1 cars at the track, in the same class, not racing each other. This will help the "Show".

Hey everyone, new racer here so I figured you all would want some info from my perspective.

I didn’t know AMP existed until last year when I started Autoslalom. Autoslalom led to lapping day which led to TRAC series. What attracted me to the series was the people. Yes racing is fun but it wouldn’t be worth while without the community.

I will reiterate some points bought up because from my perspective this is what I noticed the most.

Risk of cancelling made my investment look like it would fall through. I worked on my car in between races every month and prepared all spring. When those emails came out I questioned if I made the right decision to invest in this.

The lack of officially announcing or posting the points tally. I was looking forward to the unofficial one sent out. When I seen how close I was to GT6 championship in the WCN series it made me make sure I had the car ready for next month. Also once the series was done there was no announcement on the class championships. I had people and sponsors expecting some form of a result they were wondering how I did.

The only other thing is the advertising/marketing I guess. Most people don’t know we have a real race track in NS. I shared content every event and tried to tag sponsors and the trac page. I would think even if someone was paid a few hours a month to do the marketing/advertising it would pay for itself.

Just my two cents as a rookie.

Series Sponsor decal and placement - Decals are far too large for a Miata or Honda, ok for GT1 or larger cars. Decals should be reduced in size as they take up way-too-much real estate. They should also be more specific as to placement to make a uniformed professional appearance. No two cars have the same placement currently. Additionally as sponsors change they need to be removed or updated, currently that is not the case. If you have a rule on placement, then this should be part of tech.

I would like to see Front fender just forward of door and rocker panel only, plus windshield of course. When placing sponsor decals on a race car it is usually for contingency or other gain towards the competitor. Telling us we have to run these decals to gain points with no monetary gain to competitors is a tough one. Giving money to AMP is nice however that doesn’t promote racing. I would like to see that money go towards advertising, promoting our series, to gain spectators and sponsors. Lets try to promote, encourage past, present and future racers to attend races along with spectators

I think ARMS should donate money to AMP… not racers as we currently pay for;
AMP improvement fee or you do not get a license.
Pay an entry fee but you do not get to practice for a couple of hours
Put decals on your car or you do not get scored.
Appearance of nickel and diming sends people away with a bad taste in their mouth. Make it easier to do business with.

I like 2-day race weekends, more relaxed and if something happens to the car there is possibly time to fix it. Nice to hang out with like-minded individuals, camping, socializing, swap shop, live music that can be enjoyed over a weekend versus one day.

Should be one entrance fee for the day/weekend regardless if you run one race or all with one driver or 2-3. Having a entry fee tiered system is not promoting car count throughout the day.
Second driver series is very poorly attended. I do not have a suggestion on how to fix it however the B-series needs to be looked at. ( although just read Joel/Leigh comment above and like it) Additionally the 1-hour is also not well attended, I like the 1-hour however it is boring for spectators and most of competitors as there is not a lot of battles. Maybe just sprint races for the future and leave the JCM as the endurance race.

Hi all, more random thoughts -

Right now, we award one (1) point to the top qualifier in each class in the sprints. Is that really enough? Or is any reward really necessary? I don't know... but one single point for qualifying vs. potentially the full 60 points possible for two race wins in the series events on a given day seems a bit out of whack to me.

(And I am innocent of self promotion here, as I have never been top qualifier in my class. And probably never will be, lol.)

Second off-the-wall observation: I saw in a report from the 2023 CASC-OR race workshop that they are considering awarding bonus points for folks that run races at all their tracks. I guess as an incentive for folks to run the full schedule. Is there anything we could do to encourage participation along the same lines? We don't have multiple tracks in our schedule, so there is probably not a whole lot of benefit to us just copying this. But there must be something we could do to encourage folks to come out for all the races. Suggestions anyone?

You are correct that one point is essentially meaningless 99% of the time. It would only ever matter where there would be a tie if you considered race points only. Or someone could possibly advance a position in a close season if they qualified 1st for every race. I think it's fine at 1, it's just there as a tiebreaker in the case of 2 racers having the same points total and finishing positions.

_________________
'99 BMW M3 / "Elvic"

And since we're on the topics of 1 hours, race schedule, etc, here's a left field idea.

-One entry fee per car
-3 sprint races + 51 lap on 1st weekend (enduro points combined into sprints)
-4 sprint races every other weekend
-Points count for 3 of 4 sprints, or 2 of 3 sprints + 51 lap (incentive to continue if you have a bad off, breakout or a fixable failure.
-You would not be able to recover points wise if you break for the whole day, but that is really the case now anyway.
-Points go to car, drivers can do races as they choose (obviously still need to choose races in advance at registration, not 5 min before grid)

It would essentially eliminate the A/B races and lopsided entries in those. Some track time lost, but scheduled could be slightly more relaxed or end earlier.

I'll be honest, I just really don't care about the 1 hour. More consumables and physical energy than a sprint race but less fun. Not long enough to be a real endurance test like the JCM. Many times the winner is luck of the draw by getting a good safety car. Being on a tight budget I will continue to skip it for the most part, especially in July/August.

_________________
'99 BMW M3 / "Elvic"

interesting ideas Scott! I like them!

Building on those ideas:

-Seems there is not a lot of love from most for doing enduros every event. If we have fewer, they would likely be better attended, especially with Scotts ideas. If we do x2 two day weekends, we should have the enduros on those weekends only, on the Sundays. would be the only race event on Sunday, sprints on Saturday. Time Attack and lapping intermixed on the schedule as well. Time attack can have there main event Sunday before lunch, enduro after lunch. Maybe a hard luck warm up (open to all) for 10min sunday am. Grid walk for the enduro. Other 2 weekends would be sprints only. One day events. Don't end the day early, give more time between sessions, and a proper practice session. Short quali is good.

-Scotts ideas would mean there is only one points series. This would really streamline the podium, and to me, that makes the awards way more meaningful. Points will be posted right after every event, and promotions will make posts right after the events on winners and points news. End of season, we would have an overall champ (which would be the car, not individual driver), and we can also have a sprint champ and enduro champ. Possibly JCM can figure into enduro champ. From a promotions (think existing series sponsors) and historical trophy point of view, this throws a wrench in everything - but I don't feel we should worry about that. If we can come up with a better way to move forward, make it more fun and exciting from everyone, lets move in that direction.

-I had a promotions idea yesterday - we rent a billboard (which puts money directly back into AMP), and we track the point champs every year on the billboard. So its always at the track. I think it would be a really cool thing - kind of how sebring and road atlanta have the winners from every season, going WAY back posted along the front straight. My idea is a lot smaller, but same line of thinking. Wall of champs kind of thing.

I'm in the minority I know, but de-emphasizing qualifying and dumping the 1-hour would eliminate my two most favorite parts of our current setup. And I think I like both of those because there's an element of, call it what you will, either uncertainty or strategy involved in both. The results are not pre-ordained just based on who has the fastest car. I find most of the sprints quickly turn into time-attack style parades where 9 out of 10 cars finish exactly where you would expect, so not really all that interesting.

And while I'm at being a contrarian, I'm really not that into all the dead time between short races that everyone else seems to be craving either. It is what it is though, I guess. I think offering maximum track time for the money is the way to attract people, not less. But that's only one persons opinion.

Anyway, having brought up the issue of points for qualifying, I'd be remiss if I didn't make some sort of suggestion for improvement. And it's this: Give two points for each person you out-qualify in your class in the sprint series. No points for qualifying first if you are the only person in your class (which is what we do now). So if there are five entries in your class, top qualifier gets 8 points, second is 6, third is four, and so on. Or something like that.

I will be interested in seeing what next year looks like after all this talk!

Last minute thought: Would it be possible to bring back those 2+ hour practices we used to have on the morning of the JCM?

For some I guess, two hours is overkill. But the insurance is paid, and you don't have to go out if you don't want to. This year it was only an hour... which goes by awfully quickly if you are one of the people trying to get some non-regular series racers comfortable in your car, or troubleshooting any unexpected issues that might turn up. Probably useful if you are a returning racer entering your first event of the year, as well.